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PieFedeology - Ideological Purity in PieFed

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  • Will you provide context for state run Zionist propaganda like the BBC?

    scritto su ultima modifica di
    #21

    ::: spoiler Title
    Noooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!
    :::

  • I don't believe software can be neutral. By making banning them equally easy as not, we're saying that those choices are of equal worth - doing that is taking a side and it's the side of giving fascists an easier way in. Nope! That's how Mastodon gets forked into Truth Social.

    Interesting how this thread started out about me being too right wing and now for other people it's about me being too left wing. Heh.

    Can't please everyone and I'm not trying to.

    scritto su ultima modifica di
    #22

    Interesting how this thread started out about me being too right wing and now for other people it’s about me being too left wing. Heh.

    It's not about that, really. You'll always be too left for some and too right for others. The problem is a single person, regardless of their views, policing what others get to see or not to see, on all instances, globally.

    Decentralization of power is the name of the game for the Fediverse - that's why most people are here in the first place. They escaped Reddit, with its sweeping bans over the "wrong" opinions. They escaped Xitter, with a megalomaniac policing what everyone can say. They are tired of this, they don't need this, they despise this.

    You are the developer of a leading Threadiverse software. You contribute heavily to this world, and your decisions affect not only your project - they ripple through the whole thing. With an open heart, I call you to be open with the community you serve, and to give them what they need - open choice. Stripping them of that undermines trust in Threadiverse, tramples the spirit of freedom and tinkering, and brings drama and division instead.

    If you are genuinely concerned about right-wing folks stepping in to destroy the Threadiverse - look around. Lemmy, Mbin have no guardrails, they are open to everyone - and yet, the whole right wing is like two obscure instances, barely known or accessible. Instance admins take great care to curate their instances and purge such spaces, and users double this. The very nature of Threadiverse - a place for the people - makes the very people you align with gravitate towards it. And they know full well what worth there is in each choice.

    The reason the decisions of yours got so much resonance is exactly because people care. They care about PieFed, and, at the same time, they care about Threadiverse. They enjoy your work, and it brings unique developments not seen elsewhere. But if it keeps on these rails, as an ideological and opinionated project, it risks falling out of favor and into obscurity. None of us want that, and so, we call again: please, open PieFed for choice. You may suggest blocklists, even offer them as default - just don't bake them in and make a clear option for opt-out. Recognize some people need to make this choice. Hopefully, you trust your very own community to do what's right.

  • And nobody used that as a Reddit alternative, due to missing the federation aspect.

    What I should have said above is: you can fork Lemmy, Piefed, Mbin, use that fork on an instance and connect to the Fediverse. That's the major difference with Reddit or Facebook.

    scritto su ultima modifica di
    #23

    I mean, you can just add the federation aspect. It's opensource, the code is at your fingertips to change as you please.

  • Will you provide context for state run Zionist propaganda like the BBC?

    scritto su ultima modifica di
    #24

    Or other ones like radio free Asia?

  • PieFed has done it once again, this time adding 'warning' labels for opposing ideological perspectives, well at least one; Can't find any warnings for fascism or capitalism 🤔

    This can be demonstrated here: https://piefed.social/c/globalnews/p/1697164/sudan-civil-war-spills-over-into-neighboring-chad-peoples-dispatch

    Link Preview Image
    scritto su ultima modifica di
    #25

    Will they have a warning label for Zionist outlets?

  • This is a strong and succinct argument, cheers.

    We need peoplesdispatch.org I think it's valuable thing to have a take on events from their angle. Yet it needs to be read with an understanding that they have an angle. Using the warning icon to provide that understanding is clunky and wasn't really intended for that purpose. There has been some drift in the usage away from the original idea behind the feature.

    One day it might be good to have a different icon for providing context, separate from providing warnings.

    scritto su ultima modifica di
    #26

    It's just an armband. You know. To help with context.

  • The difference between a proprietary, politically charged, censored echo chamber and an open source "do whatever you want" platform should be obvious though.

    Free speech is about the right to say what you want, meaning the government isn't supposed to repress you for it, but it doesn't guarantee the opportunity to do so on other people's private platforms. However, in this case, you're free to host your own platform where you can say what you want.


    As an aside, I'd like to point out the "Paradox of Tolerance" and the proposed resolutions: If you're an advocate for free speech, extending that freedom to those seeking to undermine it empowers them to use it against that freedom. That way, "free speech for all" is a good intention paving the road to authoritarian hell.

    Hence, it is reasonable to deny a platform for those hostile to your principle. Popper frames it as a form of self-defense, to compromise part of the principle to protect the rest. Others frame it as a social contract of mutual respect, whereby the people violating it also forfeit their own right to demand it.

    Either way, if "free speech for all" is a self-defeating principle, an open society needs to accept some measure of illiberty for its enemies if it is to be defensible.

    scritto su ultima modifica di
    #27

    Yeah, but let's take a step back for a moment here and look at how the Fediverse is run by people. These communities and instances are all equipped to take action, moderate, curate, and create.

    The people on the Fediverse are well equipped to grapple with the Paradox of Intolerance in a public forum without the walls listening in and making decisions about doors.

  • Will they have a warning label for Zionist outlets?

    scritto su ultima modifica di
    #28

    Unsurprisingly not currently. Based on current behavior and responses doubtful in future

    https://lemmy.ml/comment/25577925

  • I mean, you can just add the federation aspect. It's opensource, the code is at your fingertips to change as you please.

    scritto su ultima modifica di
    #29

    Do you honestly not see the difference between these two? Deleting a couple lines of code or a file is just not the same as adding a feature to a codebase.

  • Yeah, but let's take a step back for a moment here and look at how the Fediverse is run by people. These communities and instances are all equipped to take action, moderate, curate, and create.

    The people on the Fediverse are well equipped to grapple with the Paradox of Intolerance in a public forum without the walls listening in and making decisions about doors.

    scritto su ultima modifica di
    #30

    without the walls listening in and making decisions about doors.

    I'm not sure what you mean with "walls listening in" when we're talking about a public forum, but the doors are perfectly openable. As the creator stated elsewhere, you can unban individual pages or delete the whole list. The "decision" is more like a suggestion.

    I understand you'd rather not have that suggestion preconfigured. I personally see no harm in it.

  • Unsurprisingly not currently. Based on current behavior and responses doubtful in future

    https://lemmy.ml/comment/25577925

    scritto su ultima modifica di
    #31

    Yeah. My question was not a serious one. I knew the answer.

  • without the walls listening in and making decisions about doors.

    I'm not sure what you mean with "walls listening in" when we're talking about a public forum, but the doors are perfectly openable. As the creator stated elsewhere, you can unban individual pages or delete the whole list. The "decision" is more like a suggestion.

    I understand you'd rather not have that suggestion preconfigured. I personally see no harm in it.

    scritto su ultima modifica di
    #32

    I'm not sure what you mean with "walls listening in" when we're talking about a public forum, but the doors are perfectly openable.

    What I mean is the code infrastructure of the public forum doesn't need to do what the users operating the platform do. These sorts of flags and tags for judgements on commentary have a direct impact on interactions between users, which is the door part of analogy.

  • PieFed has done it once again, this time adding 'warning' labels for opposing ideological perspectives, well at least one; Can't find any warnings for fascism or capitalism 🤔

    This can be demonstrated here: https://piefed.social/c/globalnews/p/1697164/sudan-civil-war-spills-over-into-neighboring-chad-peoples-dispatch

    Link Preview Image
    scritto su ultima modifica di
    #33

    I wish lemmy admins could take the code away from these dorks.

  • PieFed has done it once again, this time adding 'warning' labels for opposing ideological perspectives, well at least one; Can't find any warnings for fascism or capitalism 🤔

    This can be demonstrated here: https://piefed.social/c/globalnews/p/1697164/sudan-civil-war-spills-over-into-neighboring-chad-peoples-dispatch

    Link Preview Image
    scritto su ultima modifica di
    #34

    It's right in the name. Fed.

  • PieFed has done it once again, this time adding 'warning' labels for opposing ideological perspectives, well at least one; Can't find any warnings for fascism or capitalism 🤔

    This can be demonstrated here: https://piefed.social/c/globalnews/p/1697164/sudan-civil-war-spills-over-into-neighboring-chad-peoples-dispatch

    Link Preview Image
    scritto su ultima modifica di
    #35

    Two years ago, Lemmy.world tried a similar move with their MediaBiasFactCheck bot. It was soundly rejected by the community, and they finally relented after weeks of outcry. Why is @Rimu putting us through this again?

  • Two years ago, Lemmy.world tried a similar move with their MediaBiasFactCheck bot. It was soundly rejected by the community, and they finally relented after weeks of outcry. Why is @Rimu putting us through this again?

    scritto su ultima modifica di
    #36

    The take away was make it embedded everywhere rather than a bot addition

  • Two years ago, Lemmy.world tried a similar move with their MediaBiasFactCheck bot. It was soundly rejected by the community, and they finally relented after weeks of outcry. Why is @Rimu putting us through this again?

    scritto su ultima modifica di
    #37
  • Interesting how this thread started out about me being too right wing and now for other people it’s about me being too left wing. Heh.

    It's not about that, really. You'll always be too left for some and too right for others. The problem is a single person, regardless of their views, policing what others get to see or not to see, on all instances, globally.

    Decentralization of power is the name of the game for the Fediverse - that's why most people are here in the first place. They escaped Reddit, with its sweeping bans over the "wrong" opinions. They escaped Xitter, with a megalomaniac policing what everyone can say. They are tired of this, they don't need this, they despise this.

    You are the developer of a leading Threadiverse software. You contribute heavily to this world, and your decisions affect not only your project - they ripple through the whole thing. With an open heart, I call you to be open with the community you serve, and to give them what they need - open choice. Stripping them of that undermines trust in Threadiverse, tramples the spirit of freedom and tinkering, and brings drama and division instead.

    If you are genuinely concerned about right-wing folks stepping in to destroy the Threadiverse - look around. Lemmy, Mbin have no guardrails, they are open to everyone - and yet, the whole right wing is like two obscure instances, barely known or accessible. Instance admins take great care to curate their instances and purge such spaces, and users double this. The very nature of Threadiverse - a place for the people - makes the very people you align with gravitate towards it. And they know full well what worth there is in each choice.

    The reason the decisions of yours got so much resonance is exactly because people care. They care about PieFed, and, at the same time, they care about Threadiverse. They enjoy your work, and it brings unique developments not seen elsewhere. But if it keeps on these rails, as an ideological and opinionated project, it risks falling out of favor and into obscurity. None of us want that, and so, we call again: please, open PieFed for choice. You may suggest blocklists, even offer them as default - just don't bake them in and make a clear option for opt-out. Recognize some people need to make this choice. Hopefully, you trust your very own community to do what's right.

    scritto su ultima modifica di
    #38

    Thank you for that, I'll think about it.

  • Thank you for that, I'll think about it.

    scritto su ultima modifica di
    #39

    Jesus, some folks so revved up they can't stop brigading 😄

    Thank you!

  • I'm happy to explain. You could have just asked, though.

    During initial installation PieFed downloads a big list of 3000 right-wing domains from https://github.com/rimu/no-qanon and blocks them all. Admins can unblock them if they want but they would need to do them individually so I bet none do.

    The list includes things like fox news, breitbart, etc. Before starting work on PieFed I spent 3? years studying right wing disinformation - qanon, antivax, all that and that blocklist is an output from that. Every site on that list was reviewed personally.

    So.

    Additionally, I have manually added these warnings (not blocks) onto some domains, for piefed.social only. You can download a list of those warnings from https://join.piefed.social/wp-content/uploads/2026/05/warnings.ods

    Most of them are tabloids, AI slop farms and a handful are authoritarian government mouthpieces.

    So there's 3000 right wing sites that simply can't be linked to and 47 sites with warnings, about 10% of which are left wing. There's no need to warn for fascism because posts that link to them are not displayed in the first place.

    There's an ideological slant to PieFed for sure, and it's very much in favor of the left. That could be why maga.place and lemmychan.org use Lemmy and not PieFed.

    I'll take another look at peoplesdispatch and see if there's a less triggering warnings I can put on it.

    scritto su ultima modifica di
    #40

    Just log off, please. Nobody likes this shit

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    blaze@piefed.zipB
    Same feeling here ha ha
  • A university course is currently trying out Pixelfed

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    jomiran@lemmy.mlJ
    You'd have to be into making music. Founded in 2015, they make some of the coolest gear in the market. https://polyend.com/legacy/
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    openstars@discuss.onlineO
    I think what you are referring to is not content so much as that new communities needed - in the past - to have been added by someone before others could find them in the community listing. This was not restricted to admins though & people like Blaze had an army of alts and did much of that, as did I on my own instances as well. This was necessary before the first post could come in from each new community, needing to be performed on a per-community basis. However, PieFed made an improvement to not need to do this anymore, and then Lemmy followed suit as well, and now the whole process is much easier. Although it gives Lemmy.ml specifically veto power in that if a community is banned or the instance it is on is defederated from Lemmy.ml, then the automatic pulling in of the community name is no longer done. Technically admins - or again, I think anyone - can always add it the old way, but only if you know that it exists and how to make that happen (which isn't hard but requires crafting a URL rather than mere clicking on links). Also, the admins can designate a different instance than Lemmy.ml, though Lemmy.ml is set as the default, so this procedure is opt-out. Those PyLova devs are hella impressive!!! Rimu seems less interested in the Threadiverse these days and more in interoperability with Mastodon, despite how most of us seem to not even want that, and Mbin already exists. It's okay for him to work on whatever he wants, but it makes it all the more impressive to see how responsive the PyLova is to the needs of the people on the Threadiverse. I don't think that most instances do delete old content. Lemmy.world self-reportedly has content from decades in the past from nodeBB but I think their database got corrupted and I don't trust that. However, here is an example on my own instance https://discuss.online/post/5497584 showing the retaining of a post to a community on Lemmy.ml from 8 years ago. The PieFed thing was once again another of Rimu's rants against "unserious" meme content. He is obviously entitled to not feel forced into providing unlimited hosting for images, but I am saying that the limitation built into the PieFed software and enacted on e.g. PieFed.social may not be universally applied. I could well see e.g. lemmynsfw.app choosing differently to retain every image forever. Unfortunately there's almost no way to know short of directly asking the admin team, who may not even be aware themselves what settings are in place on their own machines. This is a limitation of all Fediverse software that I've seen, including Lemmy and Mbin, so not just PieFed. Though PyLova does have the most transparency of all of them... and yet I haven't seen even PyLova expose whatever these settings are to the public. Even though someone might make a choice as to which instance they want to make an account on (or even start up their own) if they could find the answer. I think even subscribable blocklists would only be the first part of an overall answer. Like UBlock Origin, it's going to require people to manufacture and maintain those lists. But... at least the software will support that now, so yes indeed this is the very important, crucial first step!!
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